Nods news , Factory fitted cover up / bodge replaced

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Re: Nods news , Playing again

Post by Dave ' Linwood ' Lane » Tue Feb 19, 2019 6:28 pm

Its way too old for the car but i love it anyway - its a 1930s in car tapley meter made for Ferodo.
Info here , i have the clamp mentioned as well . http://www.oldclassiccar.co.uk/brake-tester.htm
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Re: Nods news , Playing again

Post by John Simister » Tue Feb 19, 2019 6:36 pm

They were still being sold in the 1960s, I think, so Chamois-appropriate. I have one too, given to me by a friend having a clearout.
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Re: Nods news , Playing again

Post by The Nun » Tue Feb 19, 2019 6:55 pm

Never seen one before only the huge thing the mot tester put in the passenger footwell in the days they took the car out to test the brakes, bit dodgy if they weren't working right I would have thought?
I recognise the Rapier fastback ciggy lighter though 8)
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Re: Nods news , Playing again

Post by 617sqn » Tue Feb 19, 2019 7:17 pm

It's a "Wife Alert". :lol:

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Re: Nods news , Playing again

Post by Dave ' Linwood ' Lane » Tue Feb 19, 2019 7:51 pm

The Nun wrote: I recognise the Rapier fastback ciggy lighter though 8)
Still works although i stopped smoking years ago so it gets zero use , charge the vape batteries with the socket though :lol:
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Re: Nods news , Playing again

Post by bazzateer » Wed Feb 20, 2019 7:26 pm

The Nun wrote:Never seen one before only the huge thing the mot tester put in the passenger footwell in the days they took the car out to test the brakes
I've got one of those :D
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Re: Nods news , Playing again

Post by Dave ' Linwood ' Lane » Fri Feb 22, 2019 6:13 pm

Switch panel failed :roll: - not because it didnt look good or hold the switches but because its just too flimsy . Fine on a normal switch but the hazard switch takes some pushing off = it bent :shock: , MK3 is in progress and a completely different idea - pics will follow :)
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Re: Nods news , Playing again

Post by Dave ' Linwood ' Lane » Sat Feb 23, 2019 11:06 am

This Switch panel is much better , doesnt move or bend operating the rather stiff hazard switch plus I do like the curved end better :) . Made from a bit of dead wire winding machine we scrapped at work :)
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52595839_539193813236021_328443978850500608_n.jpg
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Re: Nods news , Playing again

Post by 617sqn » Sat Feb 23, 2019 12:26 pm

Looks fab, Dave. Fits right in there ! 8) 8)

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Re: Nods news , Playing again

Post by Dave ' Linwood ' Lane » Sat Feb 23, 2019 4:38 pm

Just done 40 odd miles looking for snowdrops of which we only saw a few . Still the Singer ran grand as its first proper outing of the year . :)
Maybe im imagining it but the heater felt hotter after the fan duct alterations - Annie certainly complained it was too hot in there so had to use the 60s aircon and wind the window down a tad .
One thing i have noticed is the coolant level rise in the expansion bottle is considerably more since i put the pressure cap back on the rad and the non pressure one on the bottle rather than the blank on the rad and the pressure cap on the bottle . might have to lower the cold level. its running at 80˚C at 70MPH after 6 miles without backing off .
Moose , whos suggestion this was - or anyone else for that matter - any clues as to why the bottle hot level has changed just by swapping caps over ???
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52920410_10218862209805944_8540954935280271360_n.jpg
As it was
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Re: Nods news , Might be normal , might not be - weird .

Post by 617sqn » Sat Feb 23, 2019 6:03 pm

Seems obvious to me, Dave. Unless I'm not seeing things correctly, I cannot see any outlet on your expansion tank. I believe that the caps are now the wrong way around : the rad cap allows expanded water into your exp. tank but it has no place to go. Except rise in the bottle and pressurise it. Looks dangerous to me ! Mine is the opposite way about. Expanded coolant flows into the exp. tank but can release pressurised air to atmosphere by the action of the standard 7lb rad cap through a small outlet.

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Re: Nods news , Might be normal , might not be - weird .

Post by Dave ' Linwood ' Lane » Sat Feb 23, 2019 6:17 pm

Its now basically identical to a standard Van / Husky set up , ie. pressure cap on the rad , non pressurised expansion bottle . Expansion bottle cap is permanently vented , coolant rises and falls as before.
Outlet or vent is the clear pipe just below the cap , coolant in is via the black pipe going into the bottom of the bottle
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Re: Nods news , Might be normal , might not be - weird .

Post by 617sqn » Sat Feb 23, 2019 6:24 pm

Right. OK, I see it now I've expanded the image.

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Re: Nods news , Might be normal , might not be - weird .

Post by 617sqn » Sat Feb 23, 2019 6:33 pm

Mine has a completely non-vented cap on the radiator. It seals against the top of the filler neck, leaving the overflow stub exposed. The expanded coolant then flows down that into the bottom of the expansion tank. The tank has a 7 lb cap which can release pressure over and above to atmosphere. When cooling down that cap allows air back into the exp. tank and the radiator draws coolant back from the exp. tank by negative pressure (we'll call it vacuum here). Very rarely needs any water, except when the HG failed :lol:

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Re: Nods news , Might be normal , might not be - weird .

Post by Dave ' Linwood ' Lane » Sat Feb 23, 2019 7:03 pm

617sqn wrote:Mine has a completely non-vented cap on the radiator. It seals against the top of the filler neck, leaving the overflow stub exposed. The expanded coolant then flows down that into the bottom of the expansion tank. The tank has a 7 lb cap which can release pressure over and above to atmosphere. When cooling down that cap allows air back into the exp. tank and the radiator draws coolant back from the exp. tank by negative pressure (we'll call it vacuum here). Very rarely needs any water, except when the HG failed :lol:

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Thats exactly how this was until Moose explained the air gap in the top of the rad never fills with coolant so theres always air in the system - well something like that anyway - he is better to explain such technical stuff really
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Re: Nods news , Might be normal , might not be - weird .

Post by Dave ' Linwood ' Lane » Mon Feb 25, 2019 8:41 pm

Cooling system is fine , been for a 40 mile drive today and its running superbly i must say ,
I lowered the expansion bottles cold level to 1/3rd full instead of 1/2 full , it seems the new setup of moving the rad caps means its more efficient at getting the heat out therefor the coolant rises more , certainly today it ran too cold and only got to 72˚C so i need an 82˚ or 88˚ stat
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Test run to West bay
52703791_10218878885582828_6587434952420229120_n.jpg
With the bottle now only 1/3rd full when cold 72˚ gets the bottle level to here
52684466_10218878886862860_6582123525279055872_n.jpg
72˚C equates to this on the gauge
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by moose » Tue Feb 26, 2019 6:28 pm

Cooling system working as it should thermostat is regulating the temp to 72 deg so an 82 deg stat will do the same engine will get to 82 deg and stat will open rad will remove the excess heat and stat will close and allow engine to maintain 82 deg then open again etc. Proper spark allows complete combustion of the mixture and a correctly set mixture keeps engine temp in check i.e. if you went lean the engine temp would rise. How many people rush down the route of electric water pump before getting the basics right, like a clean rad inside and out, no leaks, pressure maintained in the system and as much air as possible removed from the coolant. Less air in the coolant prevents steam bubbles that raise pressure and lift cap if the cap lifts the boiling point lowers. Think of a pan of water it takes a while to boil but if you splash water on a hot hob ring it bubbles and steams off. The imp rad cannot be filled to the top due to its shape so the only way to get it brim full is pressure cap on rad and overflow pipe into a vented container so that when it gets hot and the coolant expands and air rises to top of coolant and bubbles into overflow bottle when cap lifts. When the car cools only coolant is drawn back into the space this fills the rad brim full. You need the cap to lift a couple of times and keep a check on overflow bottle then the level should be maintained as per Dave's pictures a hot high level and a low cold level.
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by 617sqn » Wed Feb 27, 2019 7:26 am

But that's exactly how mine works, Mike. And if you remove the blank rad cap from the radiator the coolant is at the very top. There would only be the minutest bit of air (if any at all) in the top in a line with the very top of the overflow pipe. Not much more than a thimble full. If that could have a detrimental effect, I'm a chinaman :lol:

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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by moose » Thu Feb 28, 2019 7:44 am

Well in tests i have found the cap on my way there is a 00000.1 deg C temp drop :lol:

The reason i suggest it with pressure cap on the rad is the overflow pipe and bottle do not have to cope with system pressure. So can be any plastic bottle and use the basic overflow pipe you do not have to have a set up that will be pressurised when the engine is up to temp.
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by Lotus-e-Clan » Thu Feb 28, 2019 8:26 am

moose wrote:Well in tests i have found the cap on my way there is a 00000.1 deg C temp drop :lol:

The reason i suggest it with pressure cap on the rad is the overflow pipe and bottle do not have to cope with system pressure. So can be any plastic bottle and use the basic overflow pipe you do not have to have a set up that will be pressurised when the engine is up to temp.

I agree Mike. I have always done it same as you for the same logic. Pressure cap on rad. i.e. Over flow pipe into plastic container with a couple of inches of coolant when cold. Overflow container level rises when hot. After the first few hot and cold cycles the rad is brim full. Overflow container has a plain cap.

Now that I run a zero pressure system using Evans coolant, the rear rad also has a plain cap as does the overflow container.

Evans coolant still expands a tad when hot which means there is a small ebb and flow into the overflow container during a hot cold cycle. The difference is that using Evans with plain caps hose unions are not under pressure, neither is the head gasket from the water jacket side when the engine is switched off and cooling down.

It is during this cool down period period that pressurised coolant can enter the cylinders if there is a small head gasket leak that would otherwise seal itself during running. ie it's good coolant to have if you have a marginal head gasket which is all too often the case with Imp engines.
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by gr88 » Thu Feb 28, 2019 11:53 pm

.
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by Lotus-e-Clan » Fri Mar 01, 2019 12:57 am

gr88 wrote:Evans waterless coolant is the biggest scam in the 21st century.

"during the cool down the coolant can be sucked into the cylinder"

your head gasket is goosed ! If a LIQUID can force its way into the cylinder with under 7psi of pressure ! (yes they claim no pressure)
A recent compression test , i got 155psi, far more likely for a gas to pass through, in combustion the cylinder is pressured many times more !

http://www.norosion.com/evanstest.htm

a study from america where the rubbish evans came from .... (yes its biased, as is evans and their expensive scam)

Image

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Image

As you can see, the higher the glycol, the higher the heat not removed. With the imp and the Coventry school of radiator design (that'll do, the pubs open) and the imps history of poor cooling.....

Have you told your insurance ? a Ducati panigale rider changed his coolant to evans and the bike caught fire ! Insurance walked away ( modification not declared)
Another Ducati blew up and the evans non coolant had turned to jelly blocking the water pump.

Glycol is highly flamable in undiluted form, if some of evan uncoolant gets on your manifold fire will burn your vehicle. (there are over 20 evans related fires that are being investigated by insurance companies !

Good luck with your imp and its very poor pump, badly designed cooling system and all aluminium engine, i wouldnt use it lol
You are just regurgitating reports that are full of half truths and extrapolations of basic physics. I have read them all. I've generated my own data using Evans compared to water using experiments designed specifically applied to my cooling system. I'm a scientist trained in experimental design and data interpretation with 20 years teaching experience at Durham University - and I've learned how NOT to be 'the wisest fool in Googledom'.

The half truths (the true part) is that if you do a direct replacement of water coolant with Evans in an unmodified system then the differences in specific heat disadvantages a cooling system that was specifically flowed for water based coolant.

The fire stuff does not concern me at all. I have had 3 litres of Evans sprayed over the engine compartment including the combined Exhaust manifold (which does get hot due to the large valve overlap of my race cam) when I forgot to do up a hose on the pump. The worst part was the cost of replacement.

My system isn't std - it has been tweaked to account for the difference in specific heat and I don't run an Imp water pump.

Some of my data comparing the basic specific heat properties of Evans versus water is on here if you do a search. You can repeat the same experiment and see for your self using basic heating equipment (like an induction hob).

Do you own practical study (assuming you are trained in this type of work). Then show me YOUR data and your experimental design and I'll peer-review.

If you entirely rely on Professor Google for evidence, I'm duty-bound not to take your arguments seriously.

EDIT:
And if you DO want to continue a discussion on Evan's then start a new thread - this is Dave's readers car thread - only fair not to clog it up with stuff that won't interest him!
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by gr88 » Fri Mar 01, 2019 1:26 am

.
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by Lotus-e-Clan » Fri Mar 01, 2019 8:32 am

gr88 wrote:sorry wont post again.

no wonder this place is dead,....,.........................................
Please don't go... I'm sorry too. :cry:
I was tired and irritable when I posted in the early hours!

You touched a nerve and I went into Friday morning tutorial mode. :oops:

I very much regret that now and wish I'd pulled my punches.

First year students fresh from school sometimes feel the same (brutalised).

Post grads go out and brutalise unsuspecting others, thus completing the cycle of abuse.

I'm recently retired from my job and suffering withdrawal. :roll:

On the plus side you haven't paid £9500 pa just to take this kind of cr*p ... and can walk away! :lol:

I can sometimes be silly and make people laugh ..I'm not all bad! :cry:
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by Dave ' Linwood ' Lane » Fri Mar 01, 2019 5:31 pm

:roll: :roll:
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by Lotus-e-Clan » Fri Mar 01, 2019 5:58 pm

Dave ' Linwood ' Lane wrote::roll: :roll:
Sorry Dave. My bad. :|
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by Dave ' Linwood ' Lane » Fri Mar 01, 2019 7:48 pm

Lotus-e-Clan wrote:
Dave ' Linwood ' Lane wrote::roll: :roll:
Sorry Dave. My bad. :|
At least it got a conversation going on my thread :lol:
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by moose » Sat Mar 02, 2019 8:53 am

I have never been able to make my mind up about EVANS. I prefer the idea of some pressure to pack the coolant onto the hot areas inside the engine. From all the info i have read and what i have learned is if there is the correct amount of pressure to allow the water to flow efficiently and keep it packed onto the back of the exhaust valve seats it will remove more heat and prevents localised boiling .
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by The Nun » Sat Mar 02, 2019 9:44 am

When I read about Evans, if it doesnt boil until 180C does that mean your engine could in fact be overheating and you dont know about it? Such as its running at 125C so will be seized up but the coolant still hasnt boiled up so shows nothing is wrong?

Not everyone has time to keep constant watch on the temperature gauge depending on whats going on with the traffic, which if theres a problem, can shoot up to the red in a few seconds, and without the steam or boiling noise coming from the back the engine could be ruined before before even you notice whats happened?

To me it seems ok as long as everything else remains good and ok?
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by Lotus-e-Clan » Sat Mar 02, 2019 9:55 am

moose wrote:I have never been able to make my mind up about EVANS. I prefer the idea of some pressure to pack the coolant onto the hot areas inside the engine. From all the info i have read and what i have learned is if there is the correct amount of pressure to allow the water to flow efficiently and keep it packed onto the back of the exhaust valve seats it will remove more heat and prevents localised boiling .
Mike I've replied to this in my Clan Jo JASON thread to save clogging Dave's thread with garbage. Olive branch to GR88, if you are lurking, please join in the Evans conversation if you want to. Happy to hear about your concerns. I have probably had the same concerns too. Now I'm over it. :) Clan004

EDIT: Peter too.
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by yoeddynz » Thu Mar 14, 2019 6:55 pm

This last page with the arguments over coolant.

Very interesting.

I was trying to insert a GIF of micheal jackson eating popcorn but couldnt work out how to do so. Not even sure if this forum platform, which dates back to 1812, can actually handle such a thing?
[https://oldschool.co.nz/index.php?/topic/28896-was-yoeddynzs-1968-viva-mazda-v6-new-owner-welcome-guzzi-rat/
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by Dave ' Linwood ' Lane » Tue Mar 19, 2019 10:25 pm

MOTs run out as of a few days ago - seems weird not having to get one :roll: although common sense might take over and il get an MOT on it sometime
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by Lotus-e-Clan » Wed Mar 20, 2019 12:21 am

Dave ' Linwood ' Lane wrote:MOTs run out as of a few days ago - seems weird not having to get one :roll: although common sense might take over and il get an MOT on it sometime
No. Forget the M. 0.T. Just use your common -sense to keep it in good nick ! 8)
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by 617sqn » Wed Mar 20, 2019 7:22 am

Sorry guys, but I think no MOT is a very bad idea unless you have access to a ramp or pit and can make sensible inspections of the parts that you cannot ordinarily see. On top of that will be the fact you will make subtle changes to your driving to compensate for the inevitable deterioration occurring in all things mechanical. I personally have never thought this was a good idea - road tax is one thing. Mots quite another. You boys will be sympathetic to your cars : others won't and will take the cheap options.

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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by Lotus-e-Clan » Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:19 am

617sqn wrote:Sorry guys, but I think no MOT is a very bad idea unless you have access to a ramp or pit and can make sensible inspections of the parts that you cannot ordinarily see. On top of that will be the fact you will make subtle changes to your driving to compensate for the inevitable deterioration occurring in all things mechanical. I personally have never thought this was a good idea - road tax is one thing. Mots quite another. You boys will be sympathetic to your cars : others won't and will take the cheap options.

Andy G
Absolutely agree.

I should have been more explicit - the comment was aimed at Nods and the like.

I'm a firm believer in 'rule differentiation'. My MOT-less recommendation only applies to folk who 'can do' -like Dave. 8)

On the other hand, for example I wouldn't recommend 'go MOT-less' to my son if he inherited my car ..he's totally clue-less on mechanicals at this point in his life! :shock: (and he's garage-less)
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by The Nun » Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:42 am

I dont really know what the real thinking behind not needing an MOT was, if they did think, but it happened? Its not normal, at least 50 % of folk wont pay for something if they dont have to, thats life.
When the tv license is got rid of how many will continue to pay for one because its the sensible thing to do?

For them to say you dont need one and then say but its sensible to have one is a contradiction of terms in my opinion, either you do or you dont, the laws are made up by government who wont give a definitive answer, wont commit one way or the other, which is exactly why we are in the mess with Brexit.

Then of course to complicate matters even more they throw in the term not substantially modified which is taken in a multitude of ways by whoever reads it, some reading into it as oh that doesnt apply to me when others think it does, again confusion as to what is the correct way to read it.

If say a car is on its standard suspension but its been made to work in excess of its normal design parameters, ie so low it needs cutting out to work then its substantially modified in my opinion but others read it as not because its still using the original parts? Its all a cock up really.

Sorry Noddy Ive drifted off on your thread again. :?
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by 617sqn » Wed Mar 20, 2019 8:55 am

I've said it before, but I think eventually "they" will use no MOT as a means to ban those cars from certain towns and city centres. You can see it coming..... :?

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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by The Nun » Wed Mar 20, 2019 9:21 am

Maybe Andy, but then if they do that they are saying yes you must have an MOT, and unless all towns have the congestion zone cameras fitted how will they know youve gone in, what happens if you live in the town centre, you cant have a classic unless its MOTd? the policing would be such that it would be easier just to put it back how it was, all vehicles need MOT and thats it.
They are advising you to get it done if you're going abroad in it anyway with Brexit looming as other countries might not allow you in without.
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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by 617sqn » Wed Mar 20, 2019 10:17 am

Exactly. So why did they bother ? It's never made sense. I famously ended up with a €50 fine on a trip through Belgium on our way to a Going Dutch weekend. And that was for not carrying my V5 document, one which, over here, it's suggested you NEVER carry in your vehicle ! And this while we are EU members. If you can already be banned here for emissions rules, based on the age/original technology of the vehicle regardless of current condition, then its a short step to bans/fines based on MOT status. And, just so you know, ANPR cameras are everywhere already - even in our local Morrisons, amenity tip, and town border. I got a letter last year from the Fuzz, having been reported for breaking the speed limit on a local downhill section of road at the very beginning of our neighbourhood, having just exited the motorway. And this was by basically amateur do-gooders out spying with a hair dryer. :shock: You'd have no chance of avoiding a fine for using your non-MOT'd car if the worse happens.

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Re: Nods news , Its normal .

Post by RoyBlunt » Wed Mar 20, 2019 2:34 pm

Apologies to Dave/Noddy for continuing the MOT/No MOT discussion here. I think that part of the justification for saying that cars older than 40 years don't need an MOT any longer was that many MOT testers & garages are just not capable of carrying out a proper MOT on older cars because the testers are not familiar with them any longer. The MOT requires (I think - can't remember the exact wording) that the vehicle meets the requirements and legislation in force at the time the car was built. This was brought home to me a few years ago when my usual MOT garage (where the two testers/owners are both classic enthusiasts) took on a third, much younger, MOT tester. When our Suzy went in for her MOT the usual tester took the new guy with him as they went around the car - pointing out that that various things that would be an advisory or a fail on a modern car were perfectly OK on a 1966 car. The phrase I remember is '...if you stripped it and rebuilt it with all new parts it would still feel like that...'.

Anyway I will continue to take Suzy & Nel (the Spitfire) for MOTs for as long as I can find someone who is capable of making a job of the MOT. Even if, sometime in the future, I can't find a suitable MOT station to do a proper MOT on them, I'd still want somebody to put the cars on a car lift once a year and have a good look around as well as putting them on the brake tester - if only for my personal peace of mind.
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