The start of the journey

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The start of the journey

Post by Alanm » Tue Feb 27, 2018 3:54 pm

Leaving for some prep. before reaching the body shop while the engine and gearbox are given some tender love and care. Will she ever be the same?
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by AnonymousUser » Tue Feb 27, 2018 4:46 pm

...
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by bazzateer » Tue Feb 27, 2018 8:54 pm

Refurbed engine/box & body? Should be much betterer.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Alanm » Wed Feb 28, 2018 6:42 pm

My little Imp was a beauty anyway, but I wanted to improve her. Up close and personal her body wasn't excellent and that is due some quality work. The engine and gearbox are going to Transimp for repair of the gearbox and an upgrade to 1040cc for the engine, with the usual add-ons, twin carbs, sports head etc.... I'm a bit nervous about the amount of work being undertaken but hopefully it will be ok and very worthwhile.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Bobbycham » Thu Mar 01, 2018 8:51 pm

As long as at no time you call it "that effing car"
Looks quite a tidy specimen already.
What are the four points on the front (holes ?) for spot lights and wiring?

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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Grahame59 » Fri Mar 02, 2018 8:14 am

Bobbycham wrote:Looks quite a tidy specimen already.

Bob Imp005
I know this car well and you're right, it is a very tidy car as it stands. However, in the long run it is far cheaper to modify a sound car than one which needs welding, new panels, etc.

I look forward to updates on Mary's progress, Alan.

(Now you have to explain why she is called Mary!)

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Re: The start of the journey

Post by ImpManiac » Sat Mar 03, 2018 3:02 pm

I'm looking forward to following this project too. :mrgreen:

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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Alanm » Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:20 pm

The four holes in the front of Mary were for spotlights that have been removed a long time ago. They are currently bunged with rubber grommets. I'm looking for the bodyshop to repair these and I will probably fit new spots in the future but utilise some brackets that I bought some time ago. Mary is so called as she was bought new by a lady called Mary Smith-Locklin in 1966 and I bought her as a one owner car in 2013 from a dealer who had acquired the car from the lady's family after her death. My grandchildren decided that because of the ownership connection she should be referred to as Mary and we thought it was appropriate. She is now routinely referred to as Mary and we think is suits her well.

Some ideas, new LED bulbs for all stop and turn lights, good or bad?
Remove the chrome side strips and have a painted stripe instead, good or bad?
Paint the roof an alternative colour, major decision, good or bad?
Obvious upgrade, new window rubbers all round, new carpet, sound insulation, any other suggestions?

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Re: The start of the journey

Post by colin rooney » Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:06 pm

Im sure i read somewhere LED were illegal on old cars could be wrong
Imps with a different colour roof look good
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by The Nun » Tue Mar 06, 2018 9:52 pm

colin rooney wrote:Im sure i read somewhere LED were illegal on old cars could be wrong
Imps with a different colour roof look good
I think its date specific for LEDs such as post 71 you can't but pre 71 you can, something like that?
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Grahame59 » Wed Mar 07, 2018 7:29 am

Alanm wrote:Some ideas, new LED bulbs for all stop and turn lights, good or bad?
Remove the chrome side strips and have a painted stripe instead, good or bad?
Paint the roof an alternative colour, major decision, good or bad?
Obvious upgrade, new window rubbers all round, new carpet, sound insulation, any other suggestions?
Hi Alan,

LEDs
If you fit LEDs be sure they are the type that can also be viewed from the side/at an angle. Many are very direction specific and ae only bright if viewed dead-on so not good from a safety viewpoint. Personally — and this is probably just me as I have not heard anyone else say this — I find the way LEDs come on very abrupt for want of a better word. Ordinary bulbs are far more gentle the way they change from off to on. Have a look next time you are following a car with LEDs and you will see what I mean. For that reason alone I would never fit LEDs on a classic car. On a practical level, you may find the indicators won't work as the power draw is too low to activate the Imp's flasher unit though I am sure there must be a workaround for this. No doubt someone can advise. The only LED on my Imp is the interior light which I would highly recommend — the standard bulb will melt the lens if the door is left open for too long!

Side strips
Well, I suppose it depends how you want you finished car to be interpreted. When I modified my Super my aim was to make it look like a period modified car. Would a 1960s owner want to make his Super look like an Imp Basic? I doubt it. It would be a shame to remove them as they are very much part of the car's identity.

Painted roof
This could look rather good and would look very 'period'. After all, Mini Coopers had white roofs and Cooper Ss had black roofs. What colour were you thinking of? Black might look nice but how about a nice dark silver metallic, verging on anthracite. That would look stunning. You could paint the 'infill' in the side strips the same dark silver as the roof which would look great and far more subtle than the standard black infill without being so drastic as removing the strips altogether.

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Re: The start of the journey

Post by John Simister » Wed Mar 07, 2018 9:36 am

I agree with Grahame completely about the 'abruptness' of LEDs. I can't see any need for them.

The side strips are anodised aluminium on a Super Imp. Personally I'd keep them because they are part of what makes a Super look like a Super, but I like Grahame's idea of matching the roof colour with the middle section of the side strips if you go with a contrasting roof. If painting the roof a different colour, leave the rear pillars the same colour as the main bodywork so the gutter trim forms the colour divide.

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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Grahame59 » Wed Mar 07, 2018 9:41 am

John Simister wrote:If painting the roof a different colour, leave the rear pillars the same colour as the main bodywork so the gutter trim forms the colour divide.
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Absolutely. Just the roof.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by 617sqn » Wed Mar 07, 2018 9:48 am

Nowt wrong with PROPER LED's in my opinion. As Grahame said, chose those with LEDs aiming sideways as well as to the rear, especially make sure they are from a decent manufacturer and not £1.99 jobs from china that take three weeks to arrive. You can get electronic flasher cans in 2 or 3 cable design that will accept both LED's and filament lamps and flash them at the correct rate. Some even have a buzzer inside, as you will no longer have the "bink-bink" sound associated with bi-metallic flasher cans. Do a search on the forum as this subject has been covered more than once.

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Re: The start of the journey

Post by The Nun » Wed Mar 07, 2018 10:27 am

Roofs in a contrasting colour is the norm now on trendy cars such as the MINI and some small Citroens and the Fiat 500 and its has to be done so it looks like a floating roof where the pillars arent painted in the roof colour too to look good, as said.

Of course if you want real period 70s and a different colour then folk used to fit vinyl which can be had in a variety of different colours, though thats now seems to be frowned upon as it can start rusting underneath the material, but its ok if the roof is painted first and the vinyl kept treated with a boot polish.

LED bulbs do have one advantage in that it takes the current loading of your ye olde wiring though?
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by bazzateer » Wed Mar 07, 2018 10:29 am

More than happy with the LED lights I had on LNK, he'll have them again once restored since he's being modified anyway.
The Chamois Sport has 'normal' ones which are fine also. Probably stick with them as the plan is for a restoration to standard.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Grahame59 » Wed Mar 07, 2018 10:33 am

The Nun wrote:Of course if you want real period 70s and a different colour then folk used to fit vinyl which can be had in a variety of different colours, though thats now seems to be frowned upon as it can start rusting underneath the material, but its ok if the roof is painted first and the vinyl kept treated with a boot polish.
I think a painted roof would look far nicer than a vinyl roof. The latter is fine on a Stiletto (obviously) or if you wish to disguise the fitment of a Webasto type sunroof but otherwise can look a bit naff.

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Re: The start of the journey

Post by impmann » Wed Mar 07, 2018 10:34 am

John Simister wrote:I agree with Grahame completely about the 'abruptness' of LEDs. I can't see any need for them.
Well... actually there were tests done at the beginning of the noughties about this (sadly can't find this online right now, but had a paper copy in the office back in the day). From a safety perspective, as has been pointed out an LED lamp will light faster than a standard filament bulb and at 70mph this can mean a significant distance before reacting to a brake lamp. There were tests done at MIRA about this and it could be a contributing factor in saving lives - especially important in an older car, where braking distances could be longer. A reason why they are standard fit to most modern cars, perhaps?

And totally agree with Grahame about the LED lamp for the interior light - firstly they are far brighter and secondly, they don't melt the (now expensive) lens. Plus the current draw is less, which makes a difference if you are setting up your tent in a field and its dark... and you need to leave the door open to pump your airbed up. ;-)

As for indicators, you can use an inline resistor to create the correct conditions for the original relay to work. But as Andy says, you can also replace the relay with a modern solid state flasher unit.

Sadly, because of the cheap crap that some folks have been buying to save a quid or two they have made LEDs illegal for older cars. Some of us have been running LEDs for 17 years without any problems - you can buy good quality ones that last a *lot* longer than filament bulbs (better for the pocket and the environment - my old sidelight bulbs were fitted in 2003), don't have the current draw (which is useful) and provide the correct (if not better) illumination. Because of this dumbass legislation (which was easier to implement than regulating the supply - ie ensuring all LED lamps sold conformed to a proper standard) I've had to strip them out of my car (1976), although the high level LED brake light remains. Having been rear-ended because a modern miopic dummy "didn't see" the Imp's slightly less that bright and slow reacting brake lamps (compared to a modern), I feel its a safety improvement and pretty important if you are using an Imp on today's congested roads (that are full of idiots doing everything other than driving).

I see a *lot* of advantages in LEDs.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by John Simister » Wed Mar 07, 2018 11:29 am

Well, yes. Good for brake lights because they provide a usefully earlier stimulus to a following driver. Possibly for sidelights, but only if in a tungsten colour temperature - I dislike intensely the cold, bright white light emitted by standard LEDs in a classic car. But I do prefer tungsten for indicators because the transition from off to on to off is smoother and gentler on the eye. The metallic tick-tick of a regular flasher unit is pleasing, too. There's far too much visual harshness in the modern world, and far too many buzzes and beeps.

Does anyone sell an LED replacement for the interior light's festoon bulb in a warm, tungsten-like colour temperature? Now that you can buy domestic LED light bulbs in 'warm white', I have become a convert as far as the house is concerned.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by The Nun » Wed Mar 07, 2018 1:41 pm

There will probably be something else in a few years time better than LEDs judging on how fast technology is accelerating ahead, which only use a fraction of the power of even LEDs, er not that the electricity companies will like that for household stuff though :?
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by mikeyhearne » Wed Mar 07, 2018 2:23 pm

John Simister wrote:....Does anyone sell an LED replacement for the interior light's festoon bulb in a warm, tungsten-like colour temperature? Now that you can buy domestic LED light bulbs in 'warm white', I have become a convert as far as the house is concerned.
yes . there are plenty on EBay .
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by AnonymousUser » Wed Mar 07, 2018 5:45 pm

...
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Alanm » Thu Mar 08, 2018 10:02 am

Hi Guys

Many thanks for the feedback on my options for Mary. I hadn't thought my suggested changes would solicit so many responses, all of which have made me think hard about what I will do. At the moment I'm airing towards removing the strip each side of the car. I take on board the fact that some people may then not immediately recognise the car as a Super Imp or agree with what I have done, but I'm not overly concerned about that. I much prefer the cleaner look of the car without the water and dirt trap caused by the strips and I'm almost certainly going to add a vinyl stripe to compensate. This will give me the option of changing the size and colour of the vinyl stripe as often as I want. The roof will stay white and again I may decide to play with different colours over time. All my badges will loudly state the car is a Super Imp and I'm not looking for prestige, who does with an Imp, just looking to maintain a very nice little car.

LEDS have certainly split opinion. My initial idea was to improve the quality of light from the indicators and stop lights over the normal bulbs. I'll fit LEDS when I reinstall the lights and see how they look. If they are not what I imagine then I'll revert to the standard fitments. Either way its no big deal. If I need to replace the flasher unit I'll go for a replacement rather than muck about with resisters. Since my last post I've dropped the engine and gearbox off at Transimp and Dennis is going to upgrade my gearbox to MkII internals as part of the rework and repair of my synchromesh (my car is a 1966 MkII but appears to have a Mk1 gearbox!). The engine is a standard 875cc unit that matches the log book numbers and I'm having a wet liner block conversion to 1040cc, twin strombergs, inlet manifold and filters, sports cam and carrier, 533 cylinder head to sports spec. oil drain conversion, pistons, main and big end bearings replaced, sports distributor and clutch. I'm sure there will be much comment about this spec. but Dennis says it will end up as a very nice road car with much more torque and performance, maybe even as much as 65-70bhp !!!!

Brakes, still not decided whether I need to install disks on the front, I'm in two minds.

The body is now at the bodyshop and they are going to perform their miracles on that. What I hope to end up with is a very nice Imp that isn't too good to use, but is something most Imp followers would very much like to own.

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Re: The start of the journey

Post by The Nun » Thu Mar 08, 2018 11:03 am

These days of course you could have the roof wrapped in whatever finish you desire, easier than paint, can be removed to return it to original, and you could change it every month if you wanted too?
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by John Simister » Thu Mar 08, 2018 12:34 pm

Engine spec sounds good to me. It's very much like mine apart from being 1040cc rather than 998. Mine is an Allt engine too.

What exhaust system will you use? I've stayed with the Sport system on the grounds of relative quietness. I've had plenty of louder Imp exhaust systems in the past, and in the end the noise can get too annoying and you end up enjoying, and using, the car less. That said, a straight-through silencer and bigger pipes do liberate a few more bhp at higher revs. Everything is a compromise.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Alanm » Thu Mar 08, 2018 1:24 pm

Hi John

I have a relatively new sports exhaust and manifold on Mary already and it sounds just right so I intend to keep that configuration. I'm not interested in making noise for the sake of it. I'm very happy with the lovely burble I've already achieved.

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Re: The start of the journey

Post by The Nun » Thu Mar 08, 2018 1:34 pm

I would have liked a Sport system but couldnt get the manifold in Stainless, so had one of Frank's in Oz instead, it's single output bigger bore it's a nice job, will be noiser I realise that but I was fed up in the past with, even back years ago, the sport system being expensive, but in mild steel never lasted long, all stainless its fit and forget.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by John Simister » Thu Mar 08, 2018 2:18 pm

The Sport manifold, even in mild steel, will surely last a fair few years especially as we do rather fewer miles in our Imps nowadays than we did in the 70s and 80s. And the silencer is readily available in stainless. Even back in the day I used the same Sport manifold from 1972 to 1978, over about 60,000 miles, and it was still intact when I swapped it with a friend for his noisy Janspeed system. He wanted peace, I wanted pace.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by John Simister » Thu Mar 08, 2018 2:51 pm

Another point is that exhaust systems tend to last longer nowadays than they used to, because there are no corrosive lead salts in the exhaust gases. That long-lived Sport manifold I mentioned, which was already a few years old when I bought the Imp to which it was attached in 1972, was mated to three consecutive silencers in my ownership: a Burgess fitted on the way home from the car's purchase, a Harmo and a Bainbridge, still sound when I swapped to the Janspeed system. So stainless steel is undeniably a better bet for the silencer. Actually I did have to saw an inch off the manifold's outlet pipes during one silencer replacement because the ends had corroded, but it made no functional difference to anything.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Grahame59 » Thu Mar 08, 2018 3:11 pm

I too would stick with the Sport exhaust given Alan's engine spec. It is after all a road car so there is no need to swap it for a noisier setup just to gain a few extra bhp.

I've done the noisy exhaust thing in the past and am passed all that now; my Imp has a similar spec engine to Alan's other than Weber 28/36 instead of Strombergs and 998 instead of 1040 and its Sport silencer works very well and, importantly, is in keeping with the overall mildly modified character of the car.

My silencer is stainless steel and both it and the manifold are in perfect condition despite being at least 17 years old. I hadn't thought about exhausts lasting longer due to less corrosive gases but what John says is, I'm sure, correct and very interesting. It likely explains why my Smart Roadster (2003) still has its original exhaust and my 1985 Golf GTI had its original exhaust until 2005; it's replacement is still in fine fettle.

With that in mind it seems a mild steel Imp Sport manifold and stainless silencer — which is what Alan has — is an excellent combination in terms of performance/noise/cost/longevity.

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Re: The start of the journey

Post by The Nun » Thu Mar 08, 2018 3:45 pm

I have lots of added soundproofing in the Chamois so if it is a bit noisy at least I wont be hearing too much of it, but we all know the faster you go in an IMP the quieter it is as you leave the noise behind and besides I can always switch my hear aids off as well 8)
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by John Simister » Thu Mar 08, 2018 4:27 pm

Peter, at the risk of mildly, but I hope usefully, hi-jacking this thread, what did you use for soundproofing? Especially to subdue the dreaded 4000-4500rpm boom?
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Alanm » Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:48 pm

This is how I hope Mary will end up on the outside, removal of the black grill below the bumper, no redundant spotlight holes, red pinstripe (a bit more sporting) and the seals painted body colour and not black.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by John Simister » Thu Mar 08, 2018 7:07 pm

You could have a double red pinstripe like a white Stiletto has, two 1/8in stripes 1/8in apart. They would start and end pretty much where the existing metal strips do. Just a thought. Template below.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Grahame59 » Thu Mar 08, 2018 7:37 pm

John Simister wrote:You could have a double red pinstripe like a white Stiletto has, two 1/8in stripes 1/8in apart. They would start and end pretty much where the existing metal strips do. Just a thought. Template below.
That could look good and would be quite Rootes-esque into the bargain. Subtle too.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Alanm » Thu Mar 08, 2018 8:05 pm

Thanks for the template John, it’s my preferred option now.
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by Alanm » Fri Mar 09, 2018 3:44 pm

When I bought Mary in 2013 I had no idea that by the middle of this year I would have invested so much money in getting her in top-shape. Initially, after paying the purchase price, I invested in getting the mechanics in order, new adjustable shocks and springs all round, exhaust manifold and exhaust box, front steering rack assembly reworked, donuts, brakes all round, clean and under seal the floorpan. Now I have embarked on a gearbox repair and upgrade and engine rebuild and upgrade from Transimp, full bodywork repairs (the rectification of 50 years of abuse and previous poor repairs) and full respray. I had toyed with the prospect of buying a totally rebuilt Morris Minor Traveller from West Riding Classics and they turn out some incredible cars for c. £15-20k, but decided to stick with the Imp. At the end of the process my total outlay will be high, high, high!!! but I'm hoping its worth it and I can see the old girl lasting another 10-20 years with just routine expenditure on maintenance. I'm looking forward to using her more and enjoying the experience. Imp011 Imp011 Imp011
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bazzateer
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by bazzateer » Fri Mar 09, 2018 3:45 pm

John Simister wrote:Peter, at the risk of mildly, but I hope usefully, hi-jacking this thread, what did you use for soundproofing? Especially to subdue the dreaded 4000-4500rpm boom?
John,

I've bought a pack of this to use when I start putting LNK back together. no idea how good or bad it's going to be though.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SILENT-COAT- ... 1438.l2649
If I told you I was a pathological liar, would you believe me?
Barry Blackmore - Chiltern ACO, apparently.......................
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John Simister
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by John Simister » Fri Mar 09, 2018 6:29 pm

Alan, well done for sticking with the Imp and resisting a Minor Traveller. You'll love the result, I'm sure, and I've found it best to erase memories of what you've spent from the mind. My total Stiletto outlay, including a bodywork refresh, engine rebuild, near-complete brake replacement, new dampers and much else, is now at least 2.5x the purchase price, which I'm now going to forget again. Glad you like the twin-stripe idea, too.

Baz, I've used a similar soundproofing product on the rear shelf and under the rear seat, which has quietened things a bit in what wasn't a particularly noisy car in the first place. The effect isn't as dramatic as I'd hoped, though. Maybe some is needed on the floor as well.
Member number 6. First Imp bought in 1972, 10 more between then and 2019. Currently Impless.
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617sqn
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Re: The start of the journey

Post by 617sqn » Sat Mar 10, 2018 10:28 am

Baz, for that price you could buy a box of ear defenders ! :lol:

Andy G
Member No. 7500, and Stan's best mate.
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