Ginetta G15 SC and imp stories

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by bks974c » Mon Nov 18, 2013 12:52 pm

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by ImpManiac » Mon Nov 18, 2013 12:59 pm

To think, I ignored search results on the forum, thinking they'd be elsewhere! :lol: :roll: Nice work, Scott!

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Tue Nov 19, 2013 10:43 pm

ah ok, quite a bit to read and work out then lol. Cheers for the links, Ill get a headache later haha.

The kit is from jonspeed on ebay, I did order the 100cc burret but none in stock and since i dont want to wait till 18th December Ive accepted the 50cc version which is on its way to me now.

update from RR post.

Finally got an hour in the garage again after loosing the weekend to busy grown up jobs :(

Started by putting on a spare front cover and the sump to mock things up for the s/c mounts to see if my head based visions will work or not!!

firstly the plate, this is looking rough due to the fact it is really rough lol, once the charger is mounted in the correct place and the plate secured Ill be able to shape it and lighten it a little to make it look neater :)

Image

Need to find the correct thread on the block side as Ive only got one bolt that fits and no gauges! Anyone on here know what it is?

Under the plate will be two mounts on to the sump, the sump will have little square load plates welded on then the posts which will be bolted to the plate making the plate fully removable.

Image

Then I accessed my brain again for the s/c mounting posts, the orientation of the charger means 4 posts 90mm long posts....

Image

Then quickly tack welded to see if I was right, just need to finish this one off then 3 more, wire stuck in the welder so couldnt finish this one off, think I had the heat settings too high for what I was doing and the wire speed maxed out which was too low lol, Ill set it properly when I come to do the lot of them and I'm not rushing, still it is welded fine I'm just fussy.

Image

Tonight was a little premature eye eye! Started by chopping tube up as per the first post for the other 3. tacked one post then starting the next I ran outa gas, poo. So I decided that three would be a good enough amount to start eyeing up the location of the sc on the plate.

Image

So instantly you can see Ill be able to trim the plate by quite a bit, out of interest I quickly weighed the current assembly which is minus the inlets and outlets finished ect...... 7.7kg!! Erm ever get that feeling the blocks gonna crack lol.

So carrying on I used some high tech methods to line up the pulleys.....
Image
following on with penning around the posts for the locations, its at this point I realised that the side nearest the sump is 6mm narrower on the flange bolt holes meaning that I need to make two posts slightly longer to level up* the charger. *Level up a loosly used term.

Anyhow mildly confidant I removed the plate, used my awesome outlet plate to ensure I was drilling the holes in the correct place, looked the other way and drilled the holes.
Image
Image

More gas tomorrow then, Ive cut the correct length needed and the one which is to short i can cut in half and use on the sump so not all lost!

Then i need a belt, a tensioner, and see if my alternator will still fit, which is currently doubtful haha. May put it on the other side of the engine, rather not though
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by cov_climax » Tue Nov 19, 2013 11:03 pm

Chris,

Those threads for the engine mounts on a 930 block are 3/8" UNC, you can check with an old head bolt to be sure.

Or just wang an M10 tap down them for ease.

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Tue Nov 19, 2013 11:07 pm

Cheers Bri, yeah temptations where to metric them but thought Id try to be good first haha

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by ImpManiac » Thu Nov 21, 2013 12:21 pm

That's looking good, Chris. :D

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Thu Nov 21, 2013 11:00 pm

Mounted! Would have liked to get the bottom posts vertical to the sc but that would have meant not removable and fully welded. Should be fine. Think I need a new welding mask mines not working quite right. Ready to clean up the welds then paint everything.

Image

plus this turned up, bl***y big one! well longer than I thought it was going to be!!

Image
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by GURNSIMPS » Fri Nov 22, 2013 2:07 pm

Awesome as always Chris.
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Mon Dec 02, 2013 12:49 pm

Well the belt turned up the other day and I did my usual of ordering one well to small, so ordered another one which will do the job, looks like I'm between sizes lol.

So I chucked the belt on and quickly noticed that when pinching the belt to tension it the plate the charger is sitting on was able to flex towards the block taking up the belt tension so I had to come up with a method of stopping the flex, which I did tonight in a very short amount of time available.

Belt on
Image

Little plate made and welded on, this stops the front of the plate which was unsupported flexing into the engine, had to relieve a little section to miss a bump on the block as you can see so the plate sits on the front cover flat as well as a bolt through :)

Image

Image

Will shape the tab up when I do the rest of everything.

Lastly tonight I finished up by looking at how I want to reduce the monting plate size...... I cant decide between curved details or straight with small radius's between flats. What do you think? I'm swaying towards flats currently, just looks 'right' in my mind?!
(was just a quick scribble)
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Thu Dec 05, 2013 10:09 pm

Picked up my tensioner pulley from the sorting office today and had a look at it all tonight, I ended up pulling apart the now not suitable std tensioner from the charger due to orientation and found a handy post inside to bolt my pulley too!!

Hopefully this should work, if it turns out to be not strong enough then Ill machine one out of a block of alloy, worked a treat though, nice quick solution!

Image

Image

Then I placed the alternator on top of it all to see where it could fit in, I think I should be able to make a pivot point bottom mount with a sliding top mount somehow which will have a few degrees of travel for belt tensioning

Image
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by Sam G15 » Fri Dec 06, 2013 12:35 pm

Whoo hoo! Looking good, erm, isn't the tensioner positioned on the "pulling side?" wouldn't that mean that some amount of engine power is pulling the tensioner out and allowing looseness onto the slack side and the potential for slip. Having said that it is a multigroove belt and any loss would be minimal. Or you could run the engine anticlockwise? Or just run it and it won't happen cos the charger is so free spinning, or it will happen and you owe me a pint.

Cheers,

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Fri Dec 06, 2013 1:34 pm

Yeah I'm really not sure how it'll work, I do have doubts but it was so easy im willing to give it a try ha ha if it fails then ill machine one up so it pushes up from below.
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Sun Dec 08, 2013 10:37 pm

Right had ago of measuring CC's tonight.

Head combustion chamber = 25cc
TDC piston space = 7.5cc
Used head gasket = 7.5 I struggled with this so instead I took the measured Dia and depth, Pi rad squaredxH = 5cc so have used that.

seems to be a few variations of equations out there but I ended up with a figure of 7.18:1 I always quoted a figure of 7.5:1 so the equation Ive used is probably not the most accurate one but gives me a good indication!

If I take a sport head I think is 20cc (mines being fixed at the moment) and use the same method

8.14:1 so probably around 8.5:1

So Ill probably use the sport head which should help the supercharger out a little.

This is the equation I used

head cc + TDC bore cc + head gasket cc = total cc at squish

then exact size of engine (928cc) / 4 = 232cc + total squish cc = answer / squish cc's = compression :1

Other measurements I have..

Stroke std 875 = 60.37mm
Bore = 70mm
Gasket thickness on the ring 1.2mm used, 1.4mm new
Gasket ring Dia 72.7mm used, 73mm new


heres a parting photo....

Image

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by bks974c » Mon Dec 09, 2013 8:36 am

Chris

Don't quote me on this but I think the Sport is 19 and std head is 20 before any skimming.

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Mon Dec 09, 2013 8:53 am

Cheers for the info. If thats the case with 19cc the above works out at 8.36:1 so a slight lift which is only beneficial as Im really low on comp lol.

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Wed Dec 11, 2013 11:04 pm

No new photos as they would look the same as above but the oil pump is re fitted with new gasket and wellseal for good measure, the sump is now painted and fully fitted along with the baffle plate two gaskets and RTV gunk and the repaired front cover is also obviously fitted fully.

Also as I know Im not going to get chance once again this weekend to whip out the angle grinder so I used a hacksaw and a variety of files on the charger mounting plate, shaped and nearly ready for painting now, takes me back to my apprentice days this kind of work, probably why I enjoy it all :)

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Thu Dec 12, 2013 11:33 pm

Good night tonight.

This was a bother to shape by hand (to noisy to use the grinder) but mounting plate done now.

Image

then I was lucky to find out my original Alternator mount that was fitted under the Alt originally fits on top, so I had to just make a triangular mount below, the slider mount will be remade in the future, It snapped on the way up to national but held all the way there and back (then two more shows lol) so has been welded to 'use'. Will just need a slightly shorter belt 8)

Image

Looking more complete now
Image
Image


Fits perfectly between the engine and charger
Image

Just need to now add additional mounting to the rear of the alternator somehow as I think vibration killed the mount and front cover last time and I dont want that again now Ive just rebuilt the engine with new gaskets and gunks!

Pulled the charger apart about three times tonight cutting, changing and playing with the alt! Finished by running out of paint and making the plate look pants :roll: will need to pick some more up tomorrow so I can finish up at the weekend.
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:13 am

Measured the sports head cc last night. Came out at 21cc.
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by eebiegeebie » Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:23 pm

I know what Scott said previously, but 21cc sounds about right to me for an unmolested Imp head. It's a long time since I've actually measured one though!
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Mon Dec 16, 2013 1:58 pm

I can confirm that the sport head I've got hasn't been skimmed also.
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by bks974c » Mon Dec 16, 2013 2:55 pm

Can't argue with the facts :roll:

However, checked the bible - Millingtons :D and 21cc for a std head seems large as he's quoting 18.6 -19.2 depending on piston height for a CR of 10.5:1 on a 875 engine.
Page 94

Also on the same page a 21cc on a 998 will produce 10 -10.5:1

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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Mon Dec 16, 2013 3:04 pm

Should read my Millington book more to be fair. I was nearly not going to measure it but thought I best had. I was keen on getting comp up closer to 9:1 but ah well im still running really safe and its worked for 8 years + so why mess too much!!
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by eebiegeebie » Mon Dec 16, 2013 6:23 pm

Okay, just dug out my Millingtons. I see the table (page 84 in my paperback copy), but top of page 85 he gives an example "take the case of an 875cc engine which is found to have ... an existing combustion chamber volume of 21.2cc" etc. I've a funny feeling that -is- what you get on a bog standard head. To get a higher comp ratio on an 875, you have to get the chamber volume down quite a bit. I'll stand corrected, but I'm sure I've measured standard heads at 21cc before, although it's a long time ago and the old memory can certainly play tricks!
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by Sevastapol » Mon Dec 16, 2013 9:44 pm

chris, where there will be water pump? or how will cool the engine?
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Mon Dec 16, 2013 10:28 pm

I use an electric water pump, its mounted off the engine so can place it front or back
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Re: Ginetta, G15 currently under supercharged development

Post by chris » Wed Jan 22, 2014 8:52 pm

Unfortunately due to mobile photobucket updating itself I can no longer automatically upload photos to the correct miniature size for the forum without going into each one separately re-sizing then ending up with two of each in my account. Also takes up a lot of time that I just havent got, I update progresses straight after being in the garage so its always late.

Night in on the computer so have re-sized one to show progress and a video.

Image

video
Image

tensioners moved since.

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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by bks974c » Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:08 pm

Well done, successful turbo conversion now supercharged one up and running :D

What next turbo and supercharged :lol:

Looks really neat with the painted brackets etc

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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by chris » Wed Jan 22, 2014 9:26 pm

bks974c wrote:What next turbo and supercharged :lol:

Scott

...... :wink:
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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by ImpManiac » Thu Jan 23, 2014 10:02 pm

Great work, Chris! :D :D What else needs doing before the car can be driven? Do you have some sort of strengthened transmission to take the extra torque? :?:

That should be a wicked setup in a G15! I think I'll need a demonstration run! :lol:

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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by chris » Fri Jan 24, 2014 11:45 am

Std trans at the moment. Just need to add a coolant system to it and its ready for rolling road on the 21st of next month.

After that it will be on the road hopefully all being well with the setup in April as that's when the road tax becomes free!
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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by chris » Mon Jan 27, 2014 11:07 pm

Trying out attachments
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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by chris » Mon Jan 27, 2014 11:24 pm

Takes quite awhile for each upload but at least ill be able to share the odd photo with you all if anyone still interested.

Photobucket use to be so easy. Surely the link type photo take up no imp server space either?
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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by MuNi_rider » Tue Jan 28, 2014 6:49 pm

Those tyres look good... must have cost a fortune!
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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by chris » Tue Jan 28, 2014 7:27 pm

MuNi_rider wrote:Those tyres look good... must have cost a fortune!
They did.... a trip to Wilmslow derby and back lol
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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by MuNi_rider » Wed Jan 29, 2014 11:54 am

They look like they fit well though, is it any lower? The new wheels look great too 8)
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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by ImpManiac » Wed Jan 29, 2014 1:49 pm

There are great fabrication skills on display, Chris. :wink: The car is coming along very well and will be a stunner.

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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by chris » Wed Jan 29, 2014 11:08 pm

Lowness dunno only one fitted lol not looking like it's leaning over though to be fair.
Fabrication cheers lets just hope it works and reliable nothing I hate worse than a set up thats no good to use!
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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by chris » Thu Feb 13, 2014 10:12 am

More photos
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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by chris » Fri Feb 21, 2014 9:00 pm

its running and a video can be seen on this link

http://retrorides.proboards.com/thread/ ... To=1907893

One really annoying thing with it is the coolant would not stop pushing out of the bottle!! I cont figure it out :( through the whole day though it would spit it out then stop and it was holding a nice temperature no matter what (temp senders in the thermostat housing and just after) then after turning the car off after awhile starting again it would spit more out again gurrrrrr.

the neader tank has a overflow tank connected to it, the header has a srpingless cap while the overflow has a .7 cap.
1012664_10152033373208585_651268494_n.jpg
coolant tank is here and overflow tank next to it
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pump is here, lowest point in the system
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chris
Posts: 1535
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2004 11:01 am
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Car Model: g15 turbo
Location: wirral, 2mins from Imp 40
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Re: Ginetta G15 supercharged

Post by chris » Mon Feb 24, 2014 9:05 am

Oh well no discussion no interest but my theory is that the pump pushing into the tank is just too strong meaning that the water at some points is finding the easy route out so although I don't need to fit a pressurised cap as the water temp is well controlled I will do which will hopefully keep the water in.

I realise that by doing this if water was to push out into the expansion tank it wouldn't be able to return so that would be a manual task but at least its got a spare reserve if needed. But doubt it would need it.
Wanted..... FREE STILETTO...... PM Me...........worth a try haha :)
My G15 page
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