Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

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Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby Gemini » Fri Nov 14, 2014 11:37 pm

Hi All,
Just wanted to gauge whether there is any interest out there in competing on a series of or just an individual event of Gravel or Tarmac stages next year.
There are a couple of Historic championships and a few good non-damaging individual events planned for 2015.
Would be good to see some more Imps out there competing and I am undecided as to what to do next year.
Let us all know if you would or send me a pm.
Cheers Geoff
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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby Rod » Sat Nov 15, 2014 3:55 pm

Hi Geoff, everything seems to have gone very, very quiet on the stage rally front. The R.A.C. people seem to have taken over the HRCR ideas now they have the MSA championship but, although they talk value for money, costs just seem to drive anyone new away. Well me in particular since I have neither the time nor the money to even put a car together. It seems a shame because I am sure there are a number of decent stage rally Imps out there but it seems that people would rather look at them than use them.

I get the impression that the HRCR may be planning a more affordable series for next year but maybe I'm mistaken.

It would be great if a team of Imps could be out on all or any of the championships, I thought last year they were starting to make their presence felt but it all died away again.

Maybe you could do the Roger Albert Clark Rally next year if there is no great interest in other events or championships? I'm sure if enough was made of it over the course of the year then the Imp Club could really get behind it and provide service support and people to wave on the stages. Just an idea.

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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby brakedisc » Sun Nov 16, 2014 2:44 pm

It is not just the costs that drive people away. Everything to do with historic rallying brings hassle. If it is not the running order, the class structure, the regulations, the tyres, the events or the licencing requirements there is always something to cause you grief. I had hoped that things would change now that the RAC guys have got involved but it appears even worse because most of the events are based in Wales and that for most people is a long way to go for a days rallying.

I have a Clan and an Imp sitting in the workshop that I would love to use but it looks like once again we will do something else.
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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby Rod » Sun Nov 16, 2014 3:40 pm

Speaking as someone who rallied Imps back in the day but who has only watched and tried to encourage people into historic stage rallying that's interesting. I know there was hassle with tyres but has that not been resolved? The running order problem was a mess and probably the reason why the HRCR series lost so much support but the RAC people again are making a big point of putting Cat 1 cars first and including 1300 Cat 2 and 3 in that. The Imp would seem to fit very neatly into Cat 1 up to 1000cc. but I guess it would probably not be worth running a younger car or a Clan. However I am speaking as an outsider so may be missing the point badly.

Not sure most of the rallies being in Wales is a bad thing, it all depends where you live!

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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby brakedisc » Wed Nov 19, 2014 7:33 am

Rod, yes most things do get resolved but it is the hassle that that entails. Tyres was about one make then open rather that non availability due to size. Class structure does not make sense when an early Imp can run in the up to 1000cc class yet later Imp runs in the up to 1300cc class. As for 5 events in Wales, it was supposed to be the British Historic Rally Championship before it all went Pete Tong.

I do hope things will improve but with no National championship in 2015 it is not looking good.
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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby The Nun » Wed Nov 19, 2014 9:54 am

You dont think the lack of interest could be the fact that IMPs and their parts have all of a sudden shot up in price over the last year or so, prompted by the Year50 event publicity to a certain extent plus of course the cost of building a good IMP competition engine is now very steep to most people?
Theres a competition prepared IMP on e bay I noticed yesterday, they want £31000 for it?

We folk used to do this type of thing for a bit of fun on a Sunday when the odd nudge, knock, off and blown a engine could be sorted for a few quid ready for next weekend, now thats not so much the case with the IMP.
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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby Rod » Wed Nov 19, 2014 1:44 pm

Back when I started to take an interest again in historic rallying, must be about 10 years ago now there were bargains to be had. A freshly built all singing and dancing 998 Imp, £6,500. A couple of Mk 2 Lotus Cortinas, both fully prepped for £5,000 each, an Avenger Tiger for about 3 and a half, even an Escort Mexico clone for under 3 grand. Then Escort prices took off, you could be talking 60K or more. They were getting back what they paid to build them and then maybe some as opposed to the old days when such a thing just wasn't possible. Other historic rally cars followed suit and completely priced themselves out of the bargain rallying department. I've not looked too closely at what is on the market but whatever happened to the tatty but basically sound cars which I used to rally?

Later Imps and Clans would be forced into the 1300 class but would this actually be such a bad thing? How many 1300 Cat.2 cars ever appear? The RAC guys are saying that Cat2 & 3 1300cc cars can run along with the Cat1 cars first on the road so a class win could be on the cards.

I suspect that all those events in Wales is really a result of the lack of decent stage events these days. The only forests which seem to be able to be used are in Wales, N. Yorks, the Lake District and Kielder. The sort of event that I used to do, the airfield and farm track multi venues have been replaced by single venues which are, in my opinion, boring.

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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby Rod » Fri Nov 28, 2014 1:36 pm

The 'old Stager' Clubman's Rally Championship Returns for 2015

Photo: Kevin Baldwin Photo: Kevin Baldwin

The HRCR will promote a simple no nonsense closed to club stage rally championship for club members. The format will be a six round championship with seven scores available and the best four scores to count.

The championship rounds have been selected for their value for money and variety to provide what we believe will be the best Clubman's Historic Stage Championship available and are as follows:

1. Rally North Wales, Gravel Stages based at Dollgellau, 28th March
2. Historic Mini Epynt. Asphalt Stages, 3rd May
3. Rally of the Midlands. Asphalt Stages based at Mallory Park, 20th/ 21st June
4. Sweet Lamb Historic Stages. Gravel Stages, Mid Wales,19th July
5. Isle of Man Rally. Asphalt Stages based in Douglas IoM, 17th/19th Sept. To count as two rounds.
6. Cambrian. Gravel Stages based in Llandudno 17th October.

The Championship will be open to Category 1,2,3 & 4 historic specification cars with separate awards for each category, no overall winner. The Category 1 challenge will be for the Paddy Hopkirk Trophy and the popular Mini and Imp cups will be retained.

The new challenge will be launched at the HRCR open day at Gaydon Heritage Museum on the 10th January.It is expected that the registration fee will be a competitive £40 per crew and the choice of tyre supplier will be free. To register your interest please email the championship secretary John Hunt, stage@hrcr.co.uk

If anyone is interested

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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby Rod » Sun Jan 11, 2015 9:10 am

So, can we assume that nobody, other than Geoff, is going to be stage rallying an Imp?

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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby Peter Hurst » Sun Jan 11, 2015 9:27 am

The Nun wrote:You dont think the lack of interest could be the fact that IMPs and their parts have all of a sudden shot up in price over the last year or so, prompted by the Year50 event publicity to a certain extent plus of course the cost of building a good IMP competition engine is now very steep to most people?
Theres a competition prepared IMP on e bay I noticed yesterday, they want £31000 for it?

We folk used to do this type of thing for a bit of fun on a Sunday when the odd nudge, knock, off and blown a engine could be sorted for a few quid ready for next weekend, now thats not so much the case with the IMP.

There was a yellow rally prepared Imp with all the papers etc at HRCR day at Gaydon yesterday for sale at £12000

I have to admit it does seem a lot of money for an Imp but when you look at sum of parts it probably worth more in bits
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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby pubcrawler » Sun Jan 11, 2015 10:06 am

Peter Hurst wrote:There was a yellow rally prepared Imp with all the papers etc at HRCR day at Gaydon yesterday for sale at £12000
I have to admit it does seem a lot of money for an Imp but when you look at sum of parts it probably worth more in bits
Peter


I saw that and have to agree, perhaps if it was in a different colour :lol: :lol: :lol:
This was a reduced price :o
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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby Rod » Sun Jan 11, 2015 12:20 pm

Yes its been advertised elsewhere and in Impressions. my colour as well...... All I need is £12,000...

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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby brakedisc » Sun Jan 11, 2015 12:25 pm

If that car is worth that amount of money what would the Minisport Mini that was at the show be worth?

Crazy money for a car that, after a few forest events, will be fit only for the recycling bin such are the state of the roads in the forests.
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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby SimonBenoy » Sun Jan 11, 2015 2:50 pm

If it is ready to go at £12k, then I would say that that is quite cheap, certainly a lot less than it costs to build a circuit car and probably much less than it would cost to build a similar rally car.

By the time you have got a good shell, strengthened it, added a cage, put in a laminated screen and plastic side and rear windows (assuming these are permitted), approved seats and belts, extinguisher, strengthened suspension, suitable springs and shockers, good brakes, wheels and tyres etc, you will have spent quite a lot of £12k, and you don't have an engine or box yet!

Hope it finds a good home soon and joins Geoff on the stages.
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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby Rod » Sun Jan 11, 2015 3:07 pm

You would probably have to find 4 or 5 times as much for an Escort. I think this one has been built as a tarmac car so may not be up to the forests without a bit more work. Brakedisc, I doubt whether Geoff would agree on your estimation of the expected life of a rally car. Proper shell strengthening helps but my Californian managed ten seasons before the shell went past the point of no return. My Lada managed two seasons in the forests with only minimal welding and was straight and true after it and served another season at least after I sold it. Spend the money, try not to hit things, keep on top of repairs and they will last.

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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby bks974c » Sun Jan 11, 2015 6:50 pm

Sounds like Ian Fishers car - reshelled in 2011 and not too many events since. Ian competed in tarmac rallies mainly in Europe and Ireland.

Good reliability record as far as I know.

http://www.imps4ever.info/racing/rallies/ypres.html for some details

Scott
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Re: Stage Rallying 2015 - Gravel or Tarmac interest

Postby tarace » Tue Jan 13, 2015 8:39 pm

I know this car really well it would stand any type of rallying as the shell is one of the best prepared and strongest I have seen.
As regards the cost I have to say that it is very good value at this price. I in fact advised a higher asking price.
I have both serviced this Imp and competed on the same rallies many times (it has a superb finishing record) and who ever is lucky enough to get to own this car will enjoy many years of rallying. (you might be right about the colour though)
Just my thoughts guys.
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